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How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
Kung Offline
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How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
Time to unearth a deep issue of mine. Basically I can't stop myself from hating myself a great deal for not having a sex life. I have had one partner who I did things of a sexual nature with, and that was just a short period about 4 years ago. I have also kissed two other women since then but that doesn't count because it was bad and felt totally meaningless afterwards. So whenever I am in social settings with other people my age and they talk about sex and partners and stuff, I just feel like I want to die. I really kick myself and feel like I fucking suck because I haven't done what they have.

It also feels like I can't be open about it, because girls seem to think it's unattractive that my first kiss etc was at the age of 16 (rather late, but if it comes up, y'know, naturally in conversation I try to be honest about it cuz vulnerability and letting go of shame etc). I also can't shake the feeling that I am disgusting to them due to comments during my teens about my undesireability as a partner, poor self image and some other things.

So I am not very experienced, not very likely to get experienced soon, and I can't stop hating myself for it. Wat do.
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2013 08:49 AM by Kung.)
12-11-2013 11:05 PM
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FM Warrior Offline
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
Don't dwell on the past. You can't drive a car to its destination by only looking at the rearview mirror.

First kiss at 16 is NOTHING to be ashamed of; in fact, that's pretty average.

Go out and attempt to better yourself every day, whether it's in attracting women, or in something else. Don't stress yourself about the numbers.
12-12-2013 09:02 AM
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Cameron Offline
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
"I have also kissed two other women since then but that doesn't count because it was bad and felt totally meaningless afterwards. So whenever I am in social settings with other people my age and they talk about sex and partners and stuff, I just feel like I want to die. "

Woah woah woah dude! OK, you haven't had the sexual experience you would like, and you really want it (totally fine and natural) but how exactly does it make you a BAD and WORTHLESS human being because you haven't had success with women? Talk about conditions of worth!

I really think you need to do some work disputing these irrational beliefs and then go from there, read the Guide to Rational Living by Albert Ellis.

How is your self-esteem and life generally?

Be kind, because everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.
12-12-2013 10:58 AM
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LikeTheJar Offline
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
Literally the only problem you have is your in your own head. Your biggest problem is how negative and toxic your thinking is. Your lack of self esteem is crippling your ability to move forward or progress.

You need to really identify that thinking as a bad habit you need to break. Any time you start thinking that way you should identify that you shouldn't think like that, why you shouldn't think like that (because it works against what you want), and how you can reverse that thought into something more progressive. If you really want to change this is how to do it, by convincing yourself you are worth something.

Also, you are focusing WAY too heavily on your lack of experience and it probably shows when/if you approach or talk to women. If all you are telling yourself upstairs the whole time is that you're a worthless piece of shit women will think that you ARE a worthless piece of shit because you become what you identify as who you are.

Don't tell people the first time you were kissed, don't tell people of your lack of experience. That kind of thing should never be brought up in a conversation and the only time I could even think of that being a likely topic in a conversation is when you are in a relationship and your girl starts asking about your past. The reason this stuff is coming up in conversation is because of YOU. You are indirectly leading the topic to that because it's constantly on your mind and so you probably start subconsciously leading the conversation to that.

My girl's mother is SUPER insecure. She'll say something like "I need to go brush my hair, you all probably think I'm this total hick slob or something." Or she'll ask a question and follow it up with a comment like "you probably think I'm really annoying asking all of these questions," even if she only asks 1 question! It not only is annoying to be around, but it's pitiful. Don't get me wrong I love this woman to death, but her biggest problems in life derive from her negative way of thinking and her lack of self worth.

Since you've posted on this board I think it's safe to assume that you have already identified that you have a problem here. What you really need to do now is identify what that problem actually IS. It's not that you are a worthless piece of shit man, it's that you are TELLING yourself that you are a worthless piece of shit and so your actions follow suit. Knock it off! You are BETTER than that! I promise you.

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12-19-2013 07:45 PM
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djslumdog (12-20-2013)
Kung Offline
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
(12-12-2013 10:58 AM)Cameron Wrote:  "I have also kissed two other women since then but that doesn't count because it was bad and felt totally meaningless afterwards. So whenever I am in social settings with other people my age and they talk about sex and partners and stuff, I just feel like I want to die. "

Woah woah woah dude! OK, you haven't had the sexual experience you would like, and you really want it (totally fine and natural) but how exactly does it make you a BAD and WORTHLESS human being because you haven't had success with women? Talk about conditions of worth!

I really think you need to do some work disputing these irrational beliefs and then go from there, read the Guide to Rational Living by Albert Ellis.

How is your self-esteem and life generally?

EDIT: I posted a pretty ho-hum response to this, but then I found the below quote in another thread. It's a bit long, but describes me almost perfectly. I bolded the most important/accurate bits.

Quote: So to explain, a basic goal for most families is to raise healthy children who will one day become independent adults. In a healthy family, parents work to accomplish this task by assuming responsibility for their children’s emotional and physical needs. Over time, parents gradually teach their children to be independent by allowing them to assume responsibility for meeting their own needs in a developmentally appropriate manner. Thus, the primary work of children is to learn to become independent adults. Along the way, they learn to identify and act on their feelings, wants and needs. Parents take care of their own needs or seek help from adults. As a bonus, the children have also learned how to be good parents through the process of observational learning.

In narcissistic families, this basic goal becomes skewed and the meeting of parental needs becomes of primary importance for the family. This twist generally takes place some time after infancy, as the authors point out that most children of narcissistic families were well cared for as babies. In fact, it is mostly likely to occur some time after the child begins to differentiate him or her self from the parents and begins to assert their own needs. This normal developmental process is difficult for parents who are most concerned with fulfilling their own needs as a result of job stress, physical or mental disability, or lack of parenting skills, to name a few reasons [or in the case of Bill's parents, divorce - T.]…

To compensate, the parents fight back, ignoring the child’s needs and at the same time forcing the child to respond to their own by withholding attention and affection until they do so. In this way, the children’s emotional needs go unattended and they are deprived of the opportunity to experience gradual independence and learn about themselves. Instead, they learn to wait to see what their parents expect and then react, negatively or positively, to those expectations. [as a result, they also end up dealing with their adult relationships the same way, by ancticipating needs and reacting accordingly rather than asserting their own needs. - T.]

The consequence of this parenting style is that the children become a reflection of their parents’ expectations and are deprived of the opportunity to be unique. Furthermore, the children learn to ignore their feelings or become completely detached from them altogether. As a result of having no emotions on which to direct their actions, the children become dependent upon others for guidance. This is the process of becoming what the authors term a reactive and reflective individual. [and eventually, a codependent. - T]

The tendency towards reacting and reflecting will follow children of narcissistic families into adulthood. Eventually they are likely to become distressed by their own pervasive need to please others, chronic need to seek external validation, and difficulty identifying their own feelings wants and needs. They tend to suffer from a myriad of emotional stressors including anger that lies just below the surface, depression, chronic dissatisfaction, and poor self-confidence. Many also struggle with indecisiveness as they have learned to make decisions on the basis of other’s needs and expectations. Interpersonally, they tend to share a history of failed romances and have difficulty trusting in others.

***

(12-19-2013 07:45 PM)LikeTheJar Wrote:  Literally the only problem you have is your in your own head. Your biggest problem is how negative and toxic your thinking is. Your lack of self esteem is crippling your ability to move forward or progress.

You need to really identify that thinking as a bad habit you need to break. Any time you start thinking that way you should identify that you shouldn't think like that, why you shouldn't think like that (because it works against what you want), and how you can reverse that thought into something more progressive. If you really want to change this is how to do it, by convincing yourself you are worth something.

Also, you are focusing WAY too heavily on your lack of experience and it probably shows when/if you approach or talk to women. If all you are telling yourself upstairs the whole time is that you're a worthless piece of shit women will think that you ARE a worthless piece of shit because you become what you identify as who you are.

Don't tell people the first time you were kissed, don't tell people of your lack of experience. That kind of thing should never be brought up in a conversation and the only time I could even think of that being a likely topic in a conversation is when you are in a relationship and your girl starts asking about your past. The reason this stuff is coming up in conversation is because of YOU. You are indirectly leading the topic to that because it's constantly on your mind and so you probably start subconsciously leading the conversation to that.

My girl's mother is SUPER insecure. She'll say something like "I need to go brush my hair, you all probably think I'm this total hick slob or something." Or she'll ask a question and follow it up with a comment like "you probably think I'm really annoying asking all of these questions," even if she only asks 1 question! It not only is annoying to be around, but it's pitiful. Don't get me wrong I love this woman to death, but her biggest problems in life derive from her negative way of thinking and her lack of self worth.

Since you've posted on this board I think it's safe to assume that you have already identified that you have a problem here. What you really need to do now is identify what that problem actually IS. It's not that you are a worthless piece of shit man, it's that you are TELLING yourself that you are a worthless piece of shit and so your actions follow suit. Knock it off! You are BETTER than that! I promise you.

Thank you. Why should I never bring these things up? Say that I hypothetically feel 100% okay with it, shouldn't I be able to mention it? For example, if the conversation is on partners and sex, and I just sit there silent because I have little experience, doesn't hiding it create even more shame, rather than mentioning it if it comes up naturally in conversation (or even someone ASKS you)? If I was really talkative before and suddenly stopped talking at all because the conversation turned to sex it would show really clearly that I'm insecure about it.
(This post was last modified: 12-19-2013 11:30 PM by Kung.)
12-19-2013 11:04 PM
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Cameron Offline
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
Considered counselling?

either that or you need to start a long process (me too) of learning to assert your needs and desires (in a reasonable way) and like, trying to find ways to truly love yourself.

Probably both.

Be kind, because everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.
12-20-2013 09:39 AM
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LikeTheJar Offline
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
(12-19-2013 11:04 PM)Kung Wrote:  Thank you. Why should I never bring these things up? Say that I hypothetically feel 100% okay with it, shouldn't I be able to mention it? For example, if the conversation is on partners and sex, and I just sit there silent because I have little experience, doesn't hiding it create even more shame, rather than mentioning it if it comes up naturally in conversation (or even someone ASKS you)? If I was really talkative before and suddenly stopped talking at all because the conversation turned to sex it would show really clearly that I'm insecure about it.

The other poster before me said it right but I'd like to clarify. You're biggest insecurities revolve around sex. If you end up in a conversation about sex, instead of feeling ashamed/awkward about it you should just be kind of funny about it IF you are asked and just say something like "Yeah actually I'm kind of inexperienced on the topic because I'm a virigin, unbelievable I know since I'm so amazingly handsom" (enter big ass grin). That statement is more likely to get you laid. Right now you are probably being very bitter in your responses about it, your self loathing and shame is probably written all over your face. It's sad to say this, but people don't want to have to pity you, it won't get you anywhere and will only make you feel worse. Humans respond to light hearted funny responses much more than sad responses where they feel like they should do something to console you but feel awkward about it so they just avoid the situation all together. Ever have someone tell you their dad died or they were just diagnosed with cancer? It's the same thing, it's not easy to handle a response to that like it is to handle something that is light hearted and funny or engaging.

So to clarify my initial advice, you can feel free to say it if you are put on the spot and it's your only option, but you really should not have numerous occasions where your sexual experience comes into the conversation and you should never just bring it up at random because that would just be awkward. Not to mention the average people who actually discuss in detail their sexual experiences are more than likely VERY insecure, and their defense mechanism differs from yours. Where you feel reluctant to even discuss it and embarrassed when it is discussed, they want to exaggerate and embelish things that happened because they themselves are not comfortable in their sexuality and are immature. The people I hang out with are respectable people. We don't sit around talking about our sexual experiences. Sure there are times here and there where me and another guy friend will chat about something sex related but it's rare and it never puts individual people on the spot so if you are always running into this as a problem, no offense but you probably have a lot of douchy friends who aren't really helping you fix this problem or better yourself.

The bottom line though is that your self loathing and insecurity on the topic is what's the problem, not the actual issue of being sexually inexperienced you know?

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12-20-2013 07:13 PM
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Creatine Dreams Offline
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
^Spot on advice!
12-20-2013 10:51 PM
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LikeTheJar (12-23-2013)
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
(12-20-2013 07:13 PM)LikeTheJar Wrote:  
(12-19-2013 11:04 PM)Kung Wrote:  Thank you. Why should I never bring these things up? Say that I hypothetically feel 100% okay with it, shouldn't I be able to mention it? For example, if the conversation is on partners and sex, and I just sit there silent because I have little experience, doesn't hiding it create even more shame, rather than mentioning it if it comes up naturally in conversation (or even someone ASKS you)? If I was really talkative before and suddenly stopped talking at all because the conversation turned to sex it would show really clearly that I'm insecure about it.

The other poster before me said it right but I'd like to clarify. You're biggest insecurities revolve around sex. If you end up in a conversation about sex, instead of feeling ashamed/awkward about it you should just be kind of funny about it IF you are asked and just say something like "Yeah actually I'm kind of inexperienced on the topic because I'm a virigin, unbelievable I know since I'm so amazingly handsom" (enter big ass grin). That statement is more likely to get you laid. Right now you are probably being very bitter in your responses about it, your self loathing and shame is probably written all over your face. It's sad to say this, but people don't want to have to pity you, it won't get you anywhere and will only make you feel worse. Humans respond to light hearted funny responses much more than sad responses where they feel like they should do something to console you but feel awkward about it so they just avoid the situation all together. Ever have someone tell you their dad died or they were just diagnosed with cancer? It's the same thing, it's not easy to handle a response to that like it is to handle something that is light hearted and funny or engaging.

So to clarify my initial advice, you can feel free to say it if you are put on the spot and it's your only option, but you really should not have numerous occasions where your sexual experience comes into the conversation and you should never just bring it up at random because that would just be awkward. Not to mention the average people who actually discuss in detail their sexual experiences are more than likely VERY insecure, and their defense mechanism differs from yours. Where you feel reluctant to even discuss it and embarrassed when it is discussed, they want to exaggerate and embelish things that happened because they themselves are not comfortable in their sexuality and are immature. The people I hang out with are respectable people. We don't sit around talking about our sexual experiences. Sure there are times here and there where me and another guy friend will chat about something sex related but it's rare and it never puts individual people on the spot so if you are always running into this as a problem, no offense but you probably have a lot of douchy friends who aren't really helping you fix this problem or better yourself.

The bottom line though is that your self loathing and insecurity on the topic is what's the problem, not the actual issue of being sexually inexperienced you know?

Thank you! Yes it is the shame that is the problem. My being sensitive to people's reactions to me (if they seem weirded out, for example) is also a problem.

Luckily I can say with confidence that I don't mention things like this in a bitter way in conversation. Both my parents are very bitter people, and I used to be very bitter myself and resenting everyone who was good at something I was insecure about (this was 5 years ago), and I found that it did myself no favours so I have worked very hard on becoming more accepting of things and not dwell and brood over things. I would say I have a good attitude about other people, that I am accepting of people being whoever they are and that I don't hold grudges if they did something I didn't like. If I talk about myself and my experiences with people, I do it matter-of-factly and/or with a smile. I also try to be open and honest with it cuz Mark Manson.

It's just when it comes to myself that I have difficulty forgiving/accepting things. On good days it's not prevalent but on bad days I can be really down on myself. Shame is still a lingering issue for me and there are many things that are sources of shame for me, both past and present. I have trouble not being angry with myself for my "failure" at finding romance in my life. Kinda "If I was worth being together with I would have found someone who wanted me already. Since I haven't, it must mean that I suck and am worthless". Fixing my shame issues I think will be a major game changer in my life.
(This post was last modified: 12-21-2013 04:51 AM by Kung.)
12-21-2013 04:49 AM
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
Have you ever tried hypnosis? Because this self-esteem thing is a trap, is just way easier solve it from inside out. I tryed the naturalhypnosis.com 6 day package for confidence, and I can tell you it just changed my life. Also there is the hypnosisdownloads.com self-esteem package that is very good. Two other great way of improving self-confidence is with the books "Love yourself like your life depends on it." and "self-esteem guided journal". And the program blueprint decoded of RSD.

Anyway, I think a lot of the guys up there try to say what you should do. In fact only you knows what you should do. Go to websites like datingskillsreview.com and discover the best products in the market for the area you want to find out.
12-25-2013 05:11 PM
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Kung Offline
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
(12-21-2013 07:36 AM)a man called horse Wrote:  There are so many words in this thread, so very many, many words.

There's a saying in the Bible. Quit touching yourself, yes, that Bible, there's actually some wisdom in that hunk of crap if you read it like a fairy tale and are comfortable with gay undertones:

"As ye judge, so shall ye be judged."

... but not by god, 'cause he's probably not real. By yourself. You see, if your standard of value is sexual history or experience, then that you're going to apply that to other people as well as yourself. Whatever you use to measure the values of others will be what you use to measure the value of yourself. Because of this reflexive property, if you're having difficulty changing the way you measure value in yourself, simply change the way you value other people and your self perception will adjust accordingly.

In this way, you'll see this sexuality gambit as stupid and just start blurting out things you'd never thought possible. It's completely awesome and moderately obnoxious to own such confidence and present certain truths about yourself unflinchingly to other people, who sometimes are like, wait a second, isn't that something you'd rather lie about or keep secret? And you're just like, nah fuck it, I opted out of that bullshit a minute ago.

Great post! I kinda do push myself to present those truths about myself, my problem is that I am very reactive to if people find it awkward/obnoxious when I say things like that (guy talks about how he was such a horndog at twelve and tried to kiss all the girls and I'm like "lol when I was twelve I played with LEGO, I didn't think about that stuff at all" *awkward silence, I go from feeling happy and comfortable to embarassed and distressed because of their in my mind negative reaction*). Just look at my OP lol.

But do you mean I judge people by how sexually experienced they are? In that case I do it subconsciously and/or let it go because I don't let if you are a virgin or have slept with 100 women affect if you can be my friend or not. I have friends from every spectrum in that regard it doesn't affect my opinion of them either way.
12-26-2013 05:58 AM
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
a man called horse's is pretty spot on about how judging others makes you judge yourself. Judging people hardly ever adds any value to your life.

IMO as for sharing yourself and vulnerability just share when you are asked, you don't have to always go out of your way to share how inexperienced you are, thats just hard for people to respond to. I mean how would anyone respond to a convo like this; "yeah I kissed a lot of girls in highschool when I was 14". "oh I only kissed two girls ever". some might react by going "oh thats so funny" but really thats just a response to avoid the awkward silence. If you looking to make convo just connect with questions or at least compliments like "thats awesome, you were really popular" or "how tired were you from all that?" just something light.

And to add my two cents about your personal insecurities, just recognize you have them and don't think about it too much. whenever you feel really angry at yourself don't try to force it away or focus too much on it, it'll just make it grow worse in my experience. Just recognize it and let it go. Meditation helped me a lot with this. Or just try journaling and it and reviewing your thoughts, it might make you see that some of the negative jabber thats in your head makes no sense and is only making you get in your own way.

Honestly, life is too short to always be dwelling on self-anger, thinking negative thoughts, and judging both you and others. you might as well just feel happy and confident just for the sake of feeling happy and confident.
12-30-2013 08:26 AM
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
(12-30-2013 08:26 AM)nanners90 Wrote:  And to add my two cents about your personal insecurities, just recognize you have them and don't think about it too much. whenever you feel really angry at yourself don't try to force it away or focus too much on it, it'll just make it grow worse in my experience. Just recognize it and let it go. Meditation helped me a lot with this. Or just try journaling and it and reviewing your thoughts, it might make you see that some of the negative jabber thats in your head makes no sense and is only making you get in your own way.

I second nanners90's advice on meditation and journaling. One thing I learned through meditation is that I didn't have to identify with my thoughts or take them as my truth. Through meditation I started to realize that my brain was going to think thoughts just as much as my heart was going to pump blood. I shouldn't identify myself as my thoughts anymore than I should identify myself as my blood. My point being that at times my thoughts are great and other times not so much, but that's just how my brain operates.

That being said I liked nanners90's second advice on journaling. Journaling has allowed me to decrease the number of negative thoughts I have, specifically guided journaling. I used to freewrite whatever was on my mind hoping it'd be a sort of catharsis, but found that wasn't really beneficial. So I switched to answering 3-4 questions from 15 prewritten questions I created when I journal. A couple of the questions may be helpful for you in boosting your self-esteem. One of the questions is what are my strengths and how can I use those strengths to add value to the lives of others?

Another journal question is a hypothetical and for the sake of the hypothetical let's say your name was John Doe: If you were someone else and someone who had never met John Doe asked, "Why will I like John Doe and what's the good parts of his personality," how would you answer?

If you set aside ten minutes a day to answer these two questions, I'd venture to guess that you'll see an improvement in your self-esteem.

How's this relate to the sex issue you have? From reading your original post it seems like your issue in not having sex is more related to needing validation from other people and measuring up to some sort of social norm when it comes to sexuality. If you haven't already validated yourself and come to accept the person you are, it's going to be hard not to project a level of neediness when approaching women and sexual relationships. This will turn women off. I could write about this for a while, but I think it's beautifully captured in Mark's book "Models."

Good luck man!
12-30-2013 04:34 PM
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RE: How do I stop my non-existent sex life from affecting my self esteem?
Bro, ur problem is ur fucking memory of you having low self esteem, think new, build new, act new, form a new pattern of thinking, behaviour...just fucking enjoy, change bro, change, for how long will u see the same channel,picture, for how long will you have the same fear, bro u r human, change and become the star that you want...evolve...enjoy...
02-14-2014 04:11 PM
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